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Discussion Starter #1
Does anyone pay much attention to high/low GI? The reason I ask is that dates have by far the highest GI around (1.03) and I eat them by the lorry load and have a very stable weight, don't crave sugar and rarely feel hungry again after eating them.
 

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Maybe that's because you eat a lot of them :p There is common sense behind GI, my understanding of it doesn't reach past the molecular level of how much the carbohydrates are branched and thus how the body's enzymes act upon them... but in an overal way it's quite easy to understand that low GI foods get broken down slower and so keep you satiated for longer and help maintain a stable weight, whereas high GI foods get broken down quickly, lead to a spike in blood sugar, a large amount in one go, which invariably leads to you not using it all as energy and thus it getting stored away as fat.

I'd say if you generally don't eat any other high GI foods, then having the odd date binge then it won't really make much of a difference. I certainly notice getting hungrier early JUST when I have white bread instead of brown bread, or sugary cereals instead of porrige, etc.
 

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yes, its nonsense - diet only deals with glucose... so you have obviously unhealthy things such as coca cola being labelled as 'medium GI'... (coca cola contains a high content of the sugar fructose, as it is not glucose, is not counted in the glycaemic index)... the diet also has nothing to do with portion size - glycaemic load as opposed to glycaemic index... the diet also has nothing to do with the fat or protein content of the food despite amino acids and triglycerides also increase insulin... in short - i agree with you - i think it is bullocks...
 

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Oh, there's a diet based on this? I was just thinking about the general idea behind the GI.
 

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there are many fads in health and medicine - GI diet is one of them...

essentially, the diet was promoted by government nutrionalists as a knee jerk reaction to the atkin's diet but the scientific basis is flimsy...

spikes in insulin do not correlate with hunger - hunger is primarily satified much more by intakes of protein and fat and less by carbohydrates... the most important point - endocrinologists do not recommend such a diet to their diabetic patients, the only type of people where glycaemic control is essential, which should tell you what the experts think !!
 

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I wouldn't base an entire diet around it, but it isn't bollocks at all. If you want to avoid type 2 diabetes, then I would try to stay away from high GI foods (which send your blood sugar sky high and lead to the pancreas having to work over time to stabalise it) and go for low GI (which gives a nice slow release and doesn't overwork the pancreas. low GI foods will help you control blood sugar and will also help control appetite. Prof Walt Willit, the second most highliy cited clinician in the world, has 30 years of epidemiological data which shows the role of high GI in the risk of diabetes. He gave a lecture at my university a few weeks ago and the data was shocking.

Incidently, he also showed that saturated fats have a far less role in heart disease and cancer than often suggested, It leads to an elevated risk, but not nearly as much as trans fats, which frankly should be banned.
 

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The idea does seem sound, I really notice the difference between eating, eg like A_N_S, brown bread instead of white and feeling fuller for longer, or eating something sweet, getting a burst of energy then feeling lethargic after 20 mins.

The idea of feeling full and therefore not eating so much is similar to Atkins I think, only with that you eat loads of protein to feel full, and cut out the sugar and carbs to lose weight.
 

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The idea does seem sound, I really notice the difference between eating, eg like A_N_S, brown bread instead of white and feeling fuller for longer, or eating something sweet, getting a burst of energy then feeling lethargic after 20 mins.

The idea of feeling full and therefore not eating so much is similar to Atkins I think, only with that you eat loads of protein to feel full, and cut out the sugar and carbs to lose weight.
cut out carbs OMG, I possibly couldn't aaaarrrrgggghhhh;)
 

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I wouldn't base an entire diet around it, but it isn't bollocks at all. If you want to avoid type 2 diabetes, then I would try to stay away from high GI foods (which send your blood sugar sky high and lead to the pancreas having to work over time to stabalise it) and go for low GI (which gives a nice slow release and doesn't overwork the pancreas. low GI foods will help you control blood sugar and will also help control appetite. Prof Walt Willit, the second most highliy cited clinician in the world, has 30 years of epidemiological data which shows the role of high GI in the risk of diabetes. He gave a lecture at my university a few weeks ago and the data was shocking. Incidently, he also showed that saturated fats have a far less role in heart disease and cancer than often suggested, It leads to an elevated risk, but not nearly as much as trans fats, which frankly should be banned.
JBB - you are talking about a nutrionalist and quite frankly epidiomiological evidence is a poor form of evience particularly when it comes into diet which is not at all controlled... Endocrinologists are the experts in this field and as I said previously the results are not clear - if low GI was so good the evidence would state this but the evidence is very contractory... What is clear is that low GI is not recommended diet for diabetes - for which glycaemic control is essential... As for the idea of low GI food preventing diabetes in the first place - that is very controversial - the underlying cause of insulin resistance is not even known!!... As it currently stands the american diabetes association into low GI diet and diabetes have found no reason to recommend it's use and until there is conclusive proof that low GI diets work then it'll remain like this...

"If there is ambivalence in the literature concerning the role of GI in diabetes management, there is even less agreement as to whether GI could influence the risk of diabetes. In a separate study in this issue, Sahyoun et al (16) found no association in older adults between GI or glycemic load (GL) and the risk of developing type 2 diabetes. Although this study had a somewhat shorter duration and smaller sample size than several earlier studies that found an association between GI and diabetes risk, it strengthens the argument that high-GI diets per se do not increase the risk of diabetes.

The results of these studies will be disappointing to some advocates of low-GI diets. The ADA's position statement on nutrition concluded that the use of GI and GL may have a modestly greater benefit in controlling diabetes than is observed when total carbohydrate is considered alone (17). The ADA further stated that information is not sufficient to allow a conclusion that low-GL diets reduce diabetes risk; nevertheless, the consumption of low-GI foods that are rich in fiber is to be encouraged (17). The 2 studies reported in this issue of the Journal provide no compelling reason to modify those recommendations."

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/87/1/1


ps. since when did anyone in their right mind say that saturated fat caused cancer?... lol!
 

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I thought porridge is supposed to be a low GI food, and release energy slowly, but when I have porridge for breakfast I am always really hungry again an hour later. :confused:
 

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I thought porridge is supposed to be a low GI food, and release energy slowly, but when I have porridge for breakfast I am always really hungry again an hour later. :confused:
Are you putting refined sugar on your porridge. I have the opposite. If I eat a low GI meal for breakfast, I can go until lunchtime without snacking and feel really full. If I have a sugary, high GI breakfast, like a muffin, I am starving by about 11am and feel really off for the whole day. That is why I am supportive of trying to eat low GI rather than high GI foods. Regardless of whether there are clear and significant health benefits, I think it it is common sense that a slow release, complex carb is going to be better for your body than hi GI foods, which are often just refined sugars.
 

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I have the metabolism of a geriatric snail, so I can eat anything and last at least 3 hours until I start feeling hungry... but when it's winter and I'm on the porriage, I just never feel hungry, end of. It gets to the point where I'm not actually hungry but feel I probably SHOULD eat something. Some days are worse than others and I just feel bloated and horrible all day and others where I'm just starving. Even when I'm doing more intensive training I can pretty much get away with eating almost exactly the same as I would normally... just the odd bit of chocolate and chips teehee.

Also, there have been many subtle genetic polymorphisms (common differences in the genetic code between individuals that aren't unique or new, ie not mutations, technically...) that have been shown to have a correlation with the risk of developing type II diabetes. Obviously our power to detect these is still kind of in it's infancy, but diet may just be the icing on the cake for individuals that possess such risk alleles. And I would never follow any diet based on anything other than common sense.
 

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I think the concept and logic behind GI is sound and makes great sense, complex carbs make a noticeable difference for me over simple carbs... but the GI DIET is heavily flawed - You cannot base a healthy diet purely on whether you consume high or low GI carbs!!!
 

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Yeah, it should be looked at as a consideration as part of your normal diet I'd say.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
From reading this thread, I take it that the reason that dates (food of the gods) have such a high GI as opposed to other fruits etc is because they have a high glucose content as opposed to refined sugars etc that you find in mars bars and sweets etc.
 

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The Insulin index is much better. As Revenged has already said , GI is pretty guff. Best to look at the food you are eating and say...Hmm, did that grow out the ground, on a tree or was running, flying or swimming yesterday? If the answer is yes then eat away with no problemos (in the most part)
 
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