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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi everyone,

I'd like to start a new thread for a sub 16 5k.

Maybe there are some others on the forum that have already broken 17 minutes and would like to join me on this journey?

My goal is to run a sub 16 5k in Spring 2018 and then race the Horwich 5k in June 2018 to try to secure an England Masters England vest! This is a dream goal of mine.

At the moment I am just building my mileage up and mainly focusing on endurance running (easy/threshold). In addition I am committing to attending my clubs (Elswick Harriers) training sessions on a more regular basis. This should bring some regular VO2 max type sessions into my routine as well as helping me get out and run more with others. At the moment I do 99% of my training alone so I think this could be a big benefit.

Race wise XC is my main focus through the winter with the North East Harrier League fixtures (already done two races) and also the Northern Championships in Redcar in December.

I am writing more details on my sub sixteen dream running blog and I have also started a VLOG which I hope to continue on here

Wish me luck!
 

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Hey Kevin!

Interesting that you would post this as I was about to do something similar.
After a few years of not really having a focus (as in a goal time for a given distance) and then a year plagued with injuries, earlier this month I set myself that very same goal, of running a sub-16 5k.

I ran a 16:17 and a 16:21 in 1998-1999 (that 16:21 during a 10k race :lol:) and more recently time-trialled a 16:57 in 2014.

I think it may be a bit ambitious for me to aim for a sub-16 in 2018 so I will keep that part of the goal open.

I will read your blog post and then I will write some more as there are aspects I would like to discuss with you.

I think we may help each other here.

Anyone else? James? ;)

Stu, stay out of this. :notrust:
 

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Two comments about your blog post:

"In terms of the 15:59 5k, a VDOT of 64 will be required."

I guess you also use Daniels' tables for reference (I do, just as a reference). I find them pretty much spot on, especially when taking into consideration what Daniels himself says, that the "type" of athlete and training should be taken into account.

I think it's very important that you are not disregarding the shorter distances.
Daniels' VDOT tables give me little to no hope if I look from 3,000m up. But when looking at the 3,000m and 1,500m equivalents I have actually run close to that time in the 3 and better in the 15. But it's like that with all my PBs. I get "worse" on the tables as the distance increases.
I know I have to take advantage of my long-neglected speed.
It will be interesting to see what sort of times you run in the 400, 800, 1500 and 3000.

"What about weight?
When I ran my 5k PB in May I weighed myself that morning at 73.8kg. I am 6ft 2ins or 188cm. Since then my weight has moved back towards 75-76kgs as I have backed off a little bit, waiting to a push towards the Great North Run Half Marathon in September. After a two week vacation I will be looking to focus and move back towards the sub 74kg

But there could be scope to move towards 72-73kg and in doing so I could outperform my target."


I agree with you that if you eat and train well the weight will take care of itself.
I'm 181 cm and my normal weight is 69-70kg and it has been mostly like that for the last 20 years.
I do tend to get down to 65-67kg when in my best shape so what you said about yourself makes sense. I believe that you may well get down to those 72-73kg when running 15:xx.

----------------------------------

It's interesting to see how different our approaches to training are.
You seem to have everything planned and under control, whereas if someone asks me what sessions I will do next week I will not know the answer.
Not that I don't know the type of sessions I will do. I have a good idea of what I want to do when, but I tend to decide on the specifics one or two days beforehand, according to how my body feels.

(disclaimer, I am not like that with the athletes I coach but I still maintain great flexibility with their training plans)

I remember that when I ran 16:57 in 2014 I didn't do much more other than fartleks, lots of strides and threshold/tempo runs. And I ran fast whenever not specifically recovering.
I was averaging just over 50 miles/week.

One difficulty I think I may have is the lack of 5k races in Lisbon. I normally do time trials but maybe I will be lucky to get some track races from March until June.
 

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PS: two guys who have known me as an athlete for 21 and 11 years respectively have told me I won't make it. :p
 

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I think sub-16 is a way off for me! Would like to go sub-17 next year but the marathon is my priority.

Great vlog Kev, interesting to hear your goals. I’m thinking of starting a vlog about my marathon training. Sad to hear you have no marathon plans though! ;)

I agree with Fulmar weight is definitely a great way to gain speed. Obviously everyone is different but I’ve always been pretty skinny - I’m 185cm and 66kg at race weight. It’s amazing what difference a few kgs can make.

Look forward to following your progress :tup:
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I think sub-16 is a way off for me! Would like to go sub-17 next year but the marathon is my priority.

Great vlog Kev, interesting to hear your goals. I’m thinking of starting a vlog about my marathon training. Sad to hear you have no marathon plans though! ;)

I agree with Fulmar weight is definitely a great way to gain speed. Obviously everyone is different but I’ve always been pretty skinny - I’m 185cm and 66kg at race weight. It’s amazing what difference a few kgs can make.

Look forward to following your progress :tup:
Hi James - thanks very much for the comments. Take it one step at a time - you are doing great and with patience and consistency you never know how far you can go!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Hey Kevin!

Interesting that you would post this as I was about to do something similar.
After a few years of not really having a focus (as in a goal time for a given distance) and then a year plagued with injuries, earlier this month I set myself that very same goal, of running a sub-16 5k.

I ran a 16:17 and a 16:21 in 1998-1999 (that 16:21 during a 10k race :lol:) and more recently time-trialled a 16:57 in 2014.

I think it may be a bit ambitious for me to aim for a sub-16 in 2018 so I will keep that part of the goal open.

I will read your blog post and then I will write some more as there are aspects I would like to discuss with you.

I think we may help each other here.

Anyone else? James? ;)

Stu, stay out of this. :notrust:
Hi Fulmar - thanks very much and great that you are looking at a target like this. One of the things I now keep close in mind is that the journey is more important than the end point. Its about the person you become in pursuit of a goal that matters!

I feel a sense of opportunity now personally that I just have to go for - to see how fast I can go. I will keep on posting how I am getting on and great if you do too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
PS: two guys who have known me as an athlete for 21 and 11 years respectively have told me I won't make it. :p
Part of the challenge and fun will be trying to prove them wrong. I would certainly use it as fuel for the last mile in any attempt to go sub 16!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Two comments about your blog post:

"In terms of the 15:59 5k, a VDOT of 64 will be required."

I guess you also use Daniels' tables for reference (I do, just as a reference). I find them pretty much spot on, especially when taking into consideration what Daniels himself says, that the "type" of athlete and training should be taken into account.

KR Comment - yes I used Daniels

I think it's very important that you are not disregarding the shorter distances.
Daniels' VDOT tables give me little to no hope if I look from 3,000m up. But when looking at the 3,000m and 1,500m equivalents I have actually run close to that time in the 3 and better in the 15. But it's like that with all my PBs. I get "worse" on the tables as the distance increases.
I know I have to take advantage of my long-neglected speed.
It will be interesting to see what sort of times you run in the 400, 800, 1500 and 3000.

KR Comment - I haven't raced over any of those distances. I have raced 2 miles on the road with a PB of 10:34 but that was 2016. I would like to test myself over the mile and know that I need to be in the 4:30-4:40 range.

"What about weight?
When I ran my 5k PB in May I weighed myself that morning at 73.8kg. I am 6ft 2ins or 188cm. Since then my weight has moved back towards 75-76kgs as I have backed off a little bit, waiting to a push towards the Great North Run Half Marathon in September. After a two week vacation I will be looking to focus and move back towards the sub 74kg

But there could be scope to move towards 72-73kg and in doing so I could outperform my target."


I agree with you that if you eat and train well the weight will take care of itself.
I'm 181 cm and my normal weight is 69-70kg and it has been mostly like that for the last 20 years.
I do tend to get down to 65-67kg when in my best shape so what you said about yourself makes sense. I believe that you may well get down to those 72-73kg when running 15:xx.

KR Comment - I have only just started running some more miles and I am already consistently between 73-74kgs. 2017 is the first year I have really paid attention so will be interesting to see what impact it will have on performance
----------------------------------

It's interesting to see how different our approaches to training are.
You seem to have everything planned and under control, whereas if someone asks me what sessions I will do next week I will not know the answer. KR Comment - I do think having a plan is important. If I don't have one I tend to just go out and run without purpose
Not that I don't know the type of sessions I will do. I have a good idea of what I want to do when, but I tend to decide on the specifics one or two days beforehand, according to how my body feels. KR Comment - I think regular LT runs, VO2 max sessions and a consistent long run will be key for me. I will need to sharpen with speed sessions leading up to some races next Spring. In the meantime XC focus

(disclaimer, I am not like that with the athletes I coach but I still maintain great flexibility with their training plans)

I remember that when I ran 16:57 in 2014 I didn't do much more other than fartleks, lots of strides and threshold/tempo runs. And I ran fast whenever not specifically recovering.
I was averaging just over 50 miles/week. KR Comment - sounds like a good mix of running

One difficulty I think I may have is the lack of 5k races in Lisbon. I normally do time trials but maybe I will be lucky to get some track races from March until June.
Be great to keep dialogue open and accountability as we train towards this goal!
 

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Hi fulmar :)

I run sub 16 as the second half of a 10K but never a stand-alone 5K, having said that I think I've only ever race 5K twice both off-road.

fulmar you have the capacity to run sub 16, believe it my friend.
 

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Always nice to have support and encouragement :lol:
:lol:

I will keep on posting how I am getting on and great if you do too.
Excellent! I will.

Be great to keep dialogue open and accountability as we train towards this goal!
Yes. I think we can motivate each other and maybe also learn a thing or two in the process.

Hi fulmar :)

I run sub 16 as the second half of a 10K but never a stand-alone 5K, having said that I think I've only ever race 5K twice both off-road.

fulmar you have the capacity to run sub 16, believe it my friend.
Hey Stu! =)

Thank you so much for your encouragement!
 

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Fulmar - A 15.xx time by what may well be a 40+ year old would be an amazing age graded time as well. James and Kevin are but wipper snappers in comparison :) Good luck all of you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Fulmar - A 15.xx time by what may well be a 40+ year old would be an amazing age graded time as well. James and Kevin are but wipper snappers in comparison :) Good luck all of you.
I'm 37 next year but appreciate the wipper snapper comment Gary!!!
 

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Fulmar - A 15.xx time by what may well be a 40+ year old would be an amazing age graded time as well. James and Kevin are but wipper snappers in comparison :) Good luck all of you.
I'm 37 next year but appreciate the wipper snapper comment Gary!!!
:lol:

Gary, If I'm not mistaken there was a 40 year old representing Portugal at the European Masters Championships this year who ran a SB of 16:00.
Interestingly, the 5,000m in the EMC was won in 15:55, with 2nd in 16:05 and 3rd in 16:08.
That was for the M40 age group.

Kevin, for M35, the winner ran 14:42 and there were two more sub-15.
But the good news is that the second British athlete only ran 17:03.
Of course the race may have been tactical, he may have been injured, maybe it was very windy... But it seems that 15:59 would guarantee you a place in the team.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
:lol:

Kevin, for M35, the winner ran 14:42 and there were two more sub-15.
But the good news is that the second British athlete only ran 17:03.
Of course the race may have been tactical, he may have been injured, maybe it was very windy... But it seems that 15:59 would guarantee you a place in the team.
I think the key thing at Masters level is putting your hat in the ring! There are loads of M35-39 runners in the North East of England that can run low 15:00-15:59 (probably sub 15:00 as well) but the question is what is the selection process? You probably have to pay for your own travel and costs etc. which would exclude some...
 

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True. It's the same here (not as many as in the UK but we have some good masters) with many masters choosing not to go to those competitions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Hi All - I posted a training blog update on here

And hoping to upload a new VLOG soon - I will post here when done!

I did 48 miles last week which could be a record mileage week for me. Legs are sore but heart is strong!
 
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